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Lunchbox

Unpopular Wrestling Opinions XIII

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20 hours ago, Lunchbox said:

Styles and D-Bry being top workers in WWE still blows my mind. Nothing about their independent work hinted they would do well with big crowds.

 

BUT

 

Cesaro is forever the best worker in WWE. Man can work with anyone and have a good match.

Would recommend looking into the three part series that Joseph Montecilo did on Bryan's rivalry with Nigel, man is a beast.

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Oh i know what he did in ROH, but his style in that promotion and this are still so different. His match with Shima is still like one of the top ROH matches not had by Samoa Joe.

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Undertaker's streak is one of the biggest *Censored*-ups in history. I was strongly against Lesnar breaking it but even if I do give it a pass, it feels like such an afterthought with everything that went down afterwards. I maintain that he should have retired after losing because he was clearly a mess physically and it showed in his matches. But the straw that broke the camel's back for me was the decision to have him lose to Reigns a couple of years later. It was utterly pointless and negated how significant the feat of Lesnar being the one to finally beat him at 'Mania was intended to be. Not to mention, it was an absolutely dreadful match which 'Taker was in no shape to compete in. Fast forward to now and he missed 'Mania altogether last year and it honestly feels like the streak never even mattered now for a variety of reasons (his physical shape, having him lose twice etc). I never wanted the streak to end but if it did, I always wanted it remain a feat that had drastic implications and have a never-before-never-again aura to it. 

Maybe I'm being biased, but I'm not just sure what it did for Lesnar either that couldn't have been accomplished without having him end the streak.

Edited by Crazy.

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31 minutes ago, Crazy. said:

Undertaker's streak is one of the biggest *Censored*-ups in history. I was strongly against Lesnar breaking it but even if I do give it a pass, it feels like such an afterthought with everything that went down afterwards. I maintain that he should have retired after losing because he was clearly a mess physically and it showed in his matches. But the straw that broke the camel's back for me was the decision to have him lose to Reigns a couple of years later. It was utterly pointless and negated how significant the feat of Lesnar being the one to finally beat him at 'Mania was intended to be. Not to mention, it was an absolutely dreadful match which 'Taker was in no shape to compete in. Fast forward to now and he missed 'Mania altogether last year and it honestly feels like the streak never even mattered now for a variety of reasons (his physical shape, having him lose twice etc). I never wanted the streak to end but if it did, I always wanted it remain a feat that had drastic implications and have a never-before-never-again aura to it. 

Maybe I'm being biased, but I'm not just sure what it did for Lesnar either that couldn't have been accomplished without having him end the streak.

PREACH. What a waste that was. Around that time, CM Punk would've been my pick to break the thing. Dude gets to boost his Best in the World gimmick even more, and who knows, maybe the whole Punk exit would have gone very differently

If Taker had to stick around? Beat Brock, lose to Wyatt a year later (assuming they were actually gonna push Wyatt proper and not how his career has gone), or Aleister Black this year. Make someones career with this win.

Edited by Counting Lights

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Right or wrong, it gave Lesnar something no one had at the time and made him into the ultimate end boss that wreaked havoc until basically Roman and Seth came along but both had their issues (Roman: leukemia. Seth (kayfabe): his mindset) that prevented them from holding onto the top position for long and so Lesnar found his way back each time until Drew showed up and possibly vanquished the beast for good (we’ll see about that 😉). And while I still have mixed feelings about Lesnar being the guy to end the streak, it did have major implications on the main-event scene for years and the booking reflected that.

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Honestly, I had more of a problem with 'Taker losing at 'Mania for a second time, to Reigns. It just made a mockery of how special it was for Lesnar to end the streak. Everything - from the 20+ year old streak to Lesnar breaking it - was rendered pointless to me the moment Reigns beat him.

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I can get that. It didn't hold the same kind of meaning as the first time that's for sure -- but I did like how it played into the Lesnar/Reigns match-up the next year where you had the two men who defeated Taker at WM going at it.

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2 hours ago, PaperThinWalls said:

Right or wrong, it gave Lesnar something no one had at the time and made him into the ultimate end boss that wreaked havoc until basically Roman and Seth came along but both had their issues (Roman: leukemia. Seth (kayfabe): his mindset) that prevented them from holding onto the top position for long and so Lesnar found his way back each time until Drew showed up and possibly vanquished the beast for good (we’ll see about that 😉). And while I still have mixed feelings about Lesnar being the guy to end the streak, it did have major implications on the main-event scene for years and the booking reflected that.

You make a good point in that they used that win to turn Lesnar into what he is, but I suppose from there it comes down to whether you see Lesnar's "final boss" booking as a good thing or not. For me  personally, it's been the worst long term angle I've sat through in my time as a wrestling fan, and seeing Brock constantly getting the belt back for lengthy reigns and very rarely deliver fun performances has been the biggest turnoff of wrestling I've ever had. Hell, it's the main reason I rarely watch WWE these days.

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Honestly, I’d say Lesnar losing to the Old Turd at Survivor Series did more damage than Roman beating Taker a few years later. Up until SS, Brock really did feel like something special IMO, and losing to a guy who hadn’t wrestled in over a decade really hurt that.

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1 hour ago, Counting Lights said:

You make a good point in that they used that win to turn Lesnar into what he is, but I suppose from there it comes down to whether you see Lesnar's "final boss" booking as a good thing or not. For me  personally, it's been the worst long term angle I've sat through in my time as a wrestling fan, and seeing Brock constantly getting the belt back for lengthy reigns and very rarely deliver fun performances has been the biggest turnoff of wrestling I've ever had. Hell, it's the main reason I rarely watch WWE these days.

I had similar thoughts (and to some extent I still do) but after some reflection and looking back at how this story has played out, I’m less agitated now (but hey, let’s see how long that’ll last! 😁)

 

45 minutes ago, King RyderFan said:

Honestly, I’d say Lesnar losing to the Old Turd at Survivor Series did more damage than Roman beating Taker a few years later. Up until SS, Brock really did feel like something special IMO, and losing to a guy who hadn’t wrestled in over a decade really hurt that.

I can kind of get behind the rationale of having the guy who had this legendary undefeated streak be the first to find a way to *truly* beat him. If Goldberg didn’t have that undefeated streak lore and wasn’t in “Goldberg shape,” I would be a bit more peeved.

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Goldberg, man... Hate that dude with a burning passion. Every time he steps into the ring, he either ruins something good or drops an absolute stinker, or both. Beat Lesnar for absolutely no reason, beat Owens for the Universal title only to lose it to Lesnar for absolutely no reason, beat Fiend for the title for absolutely no reason. He never puts anyone over who is actually in need of it. The only exception is Braun, and that's only because Reigns needed to back out. Dreadful in-ring performances, dreadful promos, dreadful booking. He is quite easily the most pointless part-timer they've ever had.

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Goldberg being the shittiest part-timer ever is pretty accurate, but I more blame Vince for enabling and encouraging it. Say whatever you want about Brock, you tell him to go put on a banger and he’ll do it, Goldberg has never had that capability and the game has passed him by. He never had to adapt to the current landscape even though EVERYONE else did and it’s worse when he’s being put over people who are red-hot. Maybe I’m wrong, maybe I’m biased, but I don’t even think Cena would have agreed to squash Bray like that if it was offered to him. The first return was exciting but it very quickly wore off and I would really rather not see him come back.

 

I forgot that Braun match even happened.

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58 minutes ago, Crazy. said:

Goldberg, man... Hate that dude with a burning passion. Every time he steps into the ring, he either ruins something good or drops an absolute stinker, or both. Beat Lesnar for absolutely no reason, beat Owens for the Universal title only to lose it to Lesnar for absolutely no reason, beat Fiend for the title for absolutely no reason. He never puts anyone over who is actually in need of it. The only exception is Braun, and that's only because Reigns needed to back out. Dreadful in-ring performances, dreadful promos, dreadful booking. He is quite easily the most pointless part-timer they've ever had.

Dude Yes!!

The thing with Goldberg is...I don't know that he has that much passion for the pro wrestling business? I don't know the man, but I just can't see a vet of that status wanting to come back and achieve nothing that "gives back" to the company. Even Brock, as much as I dislike him, seems to enjoy being out there and has put guys over on occasion. Any time Goldberg comes back, it's to make Goldberg look good, while whoever he works with loses literally all of their momentum. I know not every veteran is gonna have the Chris Jericho mindset, but like...come on.

The only way I would ever, EVER want Goldberg to rear his head again is if it's against Drew McIntyre, and he tries to play up how Drew might have beat Brock, but he never beat Goldberg, only for Drew to catch him with a Claymore and win a 5 second match, just to solidify Drew as the Legend Part-Timer Killer.

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On 5/23/2020 at 1:55 PM, Crazy. said:

Honestly, I had more of a problem with 'Taker losing at 'Mania for a second time, to Reigns. It just made a mockery of how special it was for Lesnar to end the streak. Everything - from the 20+ year old streak to Lesnar breaking it - was rendered pointless to me the moment Reigns beat him.

Yeah taker shouldn't even have wrestled. 34 would have been perfect for a styles match, but they wasted the main event money maker that Cena vs Taker always should have been.

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On 5/20/2020 at 9:57 PM, Lunchbox said:

Oh i know what he did in ROH, but his style in that promotion and this are still so different. His match with Shima is still like one of the top ROH matches not had by Samoa Joe.

Good point.  I think you could prob turn this into a bigger discussion about why Daniel is so great, he can reinvent himself but so sutbly but at the point where you could still see, oh this guy's has changed. For example, Jericho is amazing, don't get me wrong but his whole thing is, "oh I'm different now, look at me" ya know? 

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You know what an incredibly underrated character was? Bad News Barrett. Loved everything about it. I liked Barrett throughout his time in WWE but that was easily his best work. Still pisses me off that he didn't have a single world title reign.

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Also this: 

 

look like ass but yeah

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Wade Barrett is one of the biggest missed opportunities in WWE. Like, an easy top 5 waste of talent. It depresses me so much that he doesn't even wrestle anymore. Listening to him on podcasts, it sounds like he wouldn't particularly want to go back to WWE, but man would I love to see him swing by AEW for a little run.

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They dropped the ball so many times on him, it's crazy. Nexus, Barrett Barrage, BNB... he got a serious push during all those times so that's an indication that they saw his potential, but why they decided to just give up on him after coming so far every single time will forever remain a mystery. 

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I think early 2012 they seemed like they were actually gonna pull the trigger until his injury. That shit was awful, killed his entire momentum. He got it back as BNB and then bam, another horribly timed injury.

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yeah, I wouldn't say he was underrated by the fans. But I would say they weren't that high on him due to injuries, they gave him a few smaller pushes, until they completely *censored*ed up BNB gimmick and stopped doing the promos that got hiim so over due to getting "opposite" reactions. That was probably the last straw for him too.

Shame, I really liked his work, more as a character than in ring though. If they treated him better he would have stayed maybe as a non competing character. 

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CM Punk sucked with factions. SES and New Nexus were both trash imo. When on his own, he was greatness.

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