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Oresama

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He was daring him to DQ him, is what I got from that. Either way. Yeah. That was iffy

 

I just feel that most criticism comes from a comparison to WWE's production value, as opposed to other promotions, such as ROH or Impact or any other with a TV deal. I wasn't impressed by the event either, but I think the stuff that you mentioned applies to pro wrestling as a whole, as opposed to AEW specifically.

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There's alot of fat they can trim, i get that Hebner and Ross and legendary but there are way better people for the job. Listening to JR ramble and *Censored* up and not really give a shit that he *censored*ed up last night was awful. Especially with Excalibur trying to constantly clean up his flubbs all night.

 

And most of the comparisons come because that's what AEW said they wanted to do, they wanted a war with WWE and they are going to have to deal with people comparing them to WWE and TNA since TNA tried the same shit. NJPW doesn't get the same flak because they don't want to be WWE they want to be the alternative to WWE and they do a great job of that.

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How would a wrestling company even work, if everyone started at the same playing field?

They never said that. They only stated that in regards to payment when it comes to the different divisions.

Ergo...Main Event Female Wrestler and Main Event Tag-Team and Main Event Male Wrestlers aren't discriminated against in pay.

 

And what rules were ignored? And what complicated Gimmick matches were there besides the Casino Battle Royal?

Cody blatantly using a chair in a regular match, despite a whole thing where he threw it away like 20 seconds earlier so he didn't get DQed?

You mean the spot that has existed since forever in wrestling and has never resulted in a DQ? If your opponent holds an object or is dropped onto a object (stairs, apron, ringpost, announcer table, etc.) it's not seen as a attack on your end and never has. Same with managers accidently hitting their own clients in the head.

 

This has always been the case in wrestling. If someone blatantly tries to cheat, the referee will always be more lax about someone getting retribution. And you can be sure that this is going to be a important plot point in the story going forward.

 

And Arn Anderson wasn't at ringside either. He interfered behind the referee's back. Another staple of pro wrestling

I am sure people have been DQed before for doing moves onto chairs or through tables during a match before, and there is a reason as to why when someone does do a move onto a chair when the ref is down/has their back turned they get said chair out of the ring before the ref can see it. The ring and its parts, like the turnbuckles, ropes, apron, posts, etc, have always been seen as fair game, but a chair is not part of the ring. On top of that, there is a big difference between moving out of the way of an attack and your opponent going crashing into a chair set up in the corner and outright kicking one into your opponent's face. Your point about the ref allowing leniency loses all credibility the moment the ref started screaming at Cody that he was gonna be DQed if he used the chair like 20 seconds earlier. I doubt Cody using the chair like that is gonna lead to anything. If anything having MJF distract the ref while Cody used the chair would have at least made it far more plausible.

 

Speaking of Arn, I hate how Tully didn't chase directly after him, them going down separate tunnels really didn't make sense. Honestly, that match had so many little things that stopped it being great.

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Hebner was never great? What does that even...naw. lol

A referee's job is it to be as invisible as possible. Hebner always stood out. He always became part of the match. To the point of getting physical with the wrestlers. Like kicking the arm of a wrestler who holds onto the ropes. Or shoving back Triple H in a match. There is tons of that stuff all throughout his career.

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Each AEW event gets worse and worse. Not saying All Out was horrible, overall it was ok imo. Not going to spoil anything of course. But each one after the first I've just felt kind of meh. I know they're a new company and stuff. But if you're going to keep taking digs at WWE and etc, I expect the talk to be backed up. They're not hitting out the parks as they've hyped themselves up this far. Still want them to succeed of course. But production wise and etc, AEW isn't making me want to abandon WWE. And whether they flat out said they want that or not, that's what they and everyone else has been hyping up.

I feel like going into it with that criteria is kinda setting yourself up for disappointment. Some people are only gonna watch AEW going forward. Others are gonna watch everything. They're here to provide an alternative, that doesn't mean you have to just stop watching everything else, nor do I necessarily think that's their goal for their audience.

AEW's gonna have good nights and bad nights. They're still figuring it all out. You guys gotta remember they've had less than 10 shows at this point.

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I'm really not being a cynic or a deviant about this. I promise I'm not. I want EVERY wrestling company to succeed and be prosperous. More options, the better. But you can't keep taking digs and shots( Cody with the hammer, Bucks tweeting "we're not scared" when no one was even asking them to be scared, Jericho saying that stupid shit the other day about "never hearing of anyone from NXT or they're the minor leagues" whether it's to hype your show up or not). Just focus on making AEW what it can and will be. Because quite frankly, they aren't delivering imo. Yes I know they're a new company and shit takes time. But they're production has been terrible so far. If you're gonna talk the talk, back that shit up. Because all I've been getting is standard indy show vibes. I'm sorry, that's just my opinion. Cody said they wanted to play ball, well play ball. I've never walked away from an NXT PPV and said meh. I always leave saying, damn that was fantastic. AEW has yet to make me feel that. Double or Nothing was my favorite thus far from them. But even that was perfect. I'm just as hard on them as I am on WWE for sure.

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Hebner was never great? What does that even...naw. lol

A referee's job is it to be as invisible as possible. Hebner always stood out. He always became part of the match. To the point of getting physical with the wrestlers. Like kicking the arm of a wrestler who holds onto the ropes. Or shoving back Triple H in a match. There is tons of that stuff all throughout his career.

Which is what more refs should do. Who do you remember more, Earl Hebner or Rod Zapata? Earl not taking shit like most other refs is what makes him so much more memorable.

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Hebner was never great? What does that even...naw. lol

A referee's job is it to be as invisible as possible. Hebner always stood out. He always became part of the match. To the point of getting physical with the wrestlers. Like kicking the arm of a wrestler who holds onto the ropes. Or shoving back Triple H in a match. There is tons of that stuff all throughout his career.

Which is what more refs should do. Who do you remember more, Earl Hebner or Rod Zapata? Earl not taking shit like most other refs is what makes him so much more memorable.

 

A referee's job is it to be as invisible as possible.

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Hebner was never great? What does that even...naw. lol

A referee's job is it to be as invisible as possible. Hebner always stood out. He always became part of the match. To the point of getting physical with the wrestlers. Like kicking the arm of a wrestler who holds onto the ropes. Or shoving back Triple H in a match. There is tons of that stuff all throughout his career.
Which is what more refs should do. Who do you remember more, Earl Hebner or Rod Zapata? Earl not taking shit like most other refs is what makes him so much more memorable.

A referee's job is it to be as invisible as possible.

Not really. Several big moments that improved matches were when Earl actually showed some backbone. I loved seeing shit like HHH shoving Earl, then Earl shoves HHH, which allowed HHH to get rolled up. HHH gets heel heat for assaulting the official, then faces karma when his bullying leads to him getting distracted and rolled up. Honestly, more companies need to do more with their non-wrestlers, they can really build a show.

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Well...That's the first time I've heard anyone praise that stuff long after it happened.

 

It only works for one-off moments, not if the referee does it every match. Charles Robinson running down the ramp at WM, Scott Armstrong as the crooked Authority ref, Garrett Bischoff & Slick Johnson to a lesser degree... But Earl Hebner and Bill Alfonso are notorious for getting themself involved into every match they're in. That takes the attention away from the wrestlers and ultimately shifts the whole story of the match towards the referee, who will always be the ultimate underdog.

 

Special referees for matches are supposed to be the exception. Earl Hebner made it the rule.

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Hebner was never great? What does that even...naw. lol

A referee's job is it to be as invisible as possible. Hebner always stood out. He always became part of the match. To the point of getting physical with the wrestlers. Like kicking the arm of a wrestler who holds onto the ropes. Or shoving back Triple H in a match. There is tons of that stuff all throughout his career.

Which is what more refs should do. Who do you remember more, Earl Hebner or Rod Zapata? Earl not taking shit like most other refs is what makes him so much more memorable.

 

Lets be honest, Earls only memorable because he was the guy during the Monteral Screw Job. Referees like Bryce and Knox are memorable because they do subtle things that add to the match but don't take away from the action in the ring. Bryce legit might be the best referee of all time.

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A ref's job is to do what his employer tells him to do. So if they tell him to be active in the match beyond a typical count the pin, call the submission or dq or count out role then that's what he does. Dome storylines call for that type of ref. I'm not sure where you're getting this the ref should be invisible logic. Like, is that a set in stone rule? Lol

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A ref's job is to do what his employer tells him to do. So if they tell him to be active in the match beyond a typical count the pin, call the submission or dq or count out role then that's what he does. Dome storylines call for that type of ref. I'm not sure where you're getting this the ref should be invisible logic. Like, is that a set in stone rule? Lol

Congratulation! You understand how jobs in general work.

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Well...That's the first time I've heard anyone praise that stuff long after it happened.

 

It only works for one-off moments, not if the referee does it every match. Charles Robinson running down the ramp at WM, Scott Armstrong as the crooked Authority ref, Garrett Bischoff & Slick Johnson to a lesser degree... But Earl Hebner and Bill Alfonso are notorious for getting themself involved into every match they're in. That takes the attention away from the wrestlers and ultimately shifts the whole story of the match towards the referee, who will always be the ultimate underdog.

 

Special referees for matches are supposed to be the exception. Earl Hebner made it the rule.

Considering crowds popped for it I'm not the only one.

 

Granted, I have only seen Alfonso as a manager, so I can't really speak on him, but the way Earl did it made it work. He wouldn't do it right out of the bat unless it was a guy he knew wouldn't listen to him, like HHH. He'd stay out of it at first, but if superstars kept trying to ignore him and cheat, he had no problem getting physical and start kicking hands off of ropes, etc. Just like what would happen in real life if words alone aren't cutting it. You would then move on to physically asserting your authority where possible. He'd only be part of a story if one of the wrestlers brought him into it, it isn't like the entire story of the match is permanently around him. Heck, even the example I listed above, the story can go right back to the two people in the ring without any issues.

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"Considering the crowd popped for it"?

 

You didn't read my post then.

I did. The whole aim of wrestling is to get the crowd and fans involved and to get a reaction. Nice way of dodging the main point of my post though.

 

I didn't read the rest of your post, because your first sentence was already a response to something I didn't say.

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"Considering the crowd popped for it"?

 

You didn't read my post then.

I did. The whole aim of wrestling is to get the crowd and fans involved and to get a reaction. Nice way of dodging the main point of my post though.

I didn't read the rest of your post, because your first sentence was already a response to something I didn't say.
It was a response. You said having Earl show any form of physicality takes away from a match, I was saying it doesn't and he was able to make it work.
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NWA is going to come out of the gate as a better product than both RoH and Impact. I'm sure of it.

 

Not knowing which network it will air on is a minor detail. We've already seen Corgan's vision of NWA at the Crockett Cup, which was almost a perfect show from start to finish, despite not exactly having the most "stacked" roster. If they could do that much with so little...while also sharing the spotlight with RoH and not even having their own proper stage...then, yeah...they're going to be bigger than people think. They have a solid list of champions, and they're signing the right people. It's going to be a unique product that can contend with the other big promotions. No doubt about it.

 

The reason why I think NWA is going to be a better show than AEW, is because they only care about NWA. They aren't out to have a "war" with NXT, or WWE...or sell t-shirts, or run a comedy show on youtube. They only care about putting NWA back on the map. And if you care about something to the degree that I think Corgan cares about the legacy of the NWA, I have no doubt that he will accomplish that. It's tunnel vision. He wants to make that name mean something again. Whereas, I still don't think AEW knows exactly who or what they are.

I'm loving AEW overall and don't think NWA will have a bigger buzz than them right now but what you said is a big reason why I'm excited about NWA getting a tv deal and am more interested in the product.

 

NWA are just focused on brand legacy and pro wrestling on their show than being an alternative/competition or changing the wrestling world. Billy Gorgan is doing a great job and has a good balanced/realistic vision!

 

I like Tony Khan a lot but not sure about a bunch of talent by his ears getting his full attention. Cody/Kenny and Young Bucks are all great but not sure about all 4 being Executive Presidents with others on the roster also having backstage roles

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