LEGION Posted March 1, 2015 Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 No. I want a proper Hardcore division. WWE's 24/7 rule didn't even come close to what it could have been and to was always the worst part of any WWE show back in the day. (Mainly followed WCW back then though.) My problem with the Hardcore title is that it actually IS only half a joke. It's too serious too be seen different from other championships (Hardcore title reigns are still seen as a accomplishment as stated by the commentators), while it is also too funny to be valuable. (Just look at the places were people won/lost the title and their reactions to doing so.) The 24/7 rule would need to be much much more ridicoulus than that. For example. A summary of DDT's mockery of WWE's Hardcore title rule: Former Ironman Heavymetalweight Champions[edit] As of February 2015 there have been over 1,020 title changes for the belt, which has been won by numerous male and female wrestlers and non-wrestlers, including children, animals and inanimate objects. Animals[edit] Yatchan - A monkey Cocolo - A miniature Dachshund dog. Inanimate objects[edit] Kitty-Chan - a stuffed 'Hello Kitty' doll Mah-Kun - another stuffed doll, who defeated 'Kitty-Chan' for the belt A baseball bat - lost the belt after being broken in half as a 'KO' decision Three different ladders - each fell on the champion and a pinfall was counted, with some successfully defending the title by not being pinned during the time limit battle royal matches. Chiririn - a chicken doll Mr. Kasai - a stuffed Jun Kasai doll. Mr. Kasai has won the belt twice. A Pro Wrestling Wave poster. Ice Ribbon ringside mat. A pint of beer. A stick of yakitori. A steel chair. "K?my?", a painting by Akihiro Miwa. The title belt itself. Yoshihiko - An inflatable 'love doll'. Wrestlers treat it as if it actually was an active wrestler, and actually sell moves "done" by him/her, mostly high flying moves. For some moves, like outside dives, Yoshihiko is helped by one or more assistants, who throw him out of the ring, pull his foot on the ropes, etc. Opposing wrestlers make like those assistants are not there and are part of Yoshihiko. The original Yoshihiko was "killed" by an Antonio Honda knee drop, which caused its head to burst open, and was replaced by a second Yoshihiko, who was also a 'love doll', only modified to resemble the Great Muta. The second Yoshihiko was killed by Kenny Omega by a giant swing that sent Yoshihiko out of the ring, thus splitting his head open and revealing cotton stuffing. Later on in that match however, a third Yoshihiko came out resembling The Undertaker's old American Bad Ass gimmick, even using the same theme music. Following that match, the third Yoshihiko was shot to death by Antonio Honda. A fourth Yoshihiko, resembling Hulk Hogan, debuted shorty afterwards. Akihiro, another inflatable love doll and the supposed sister of Yoshihiko. Made its debut on August 18, 2013. Non-existent[edit] Misutero - An "invisible wrestler" i.e. non-existent. Opponents sell moves of a wrestler who isn't there, and the title is held by nothing and no-one but the wrestlers and referees act as if they can see and pin the "invisible wrestler". Muscle Sakai "won" the title from this "invisible wrestler" by using a "ray gun" and "infrared visor" to shoot the "invisible wrestler", winning the belt on a KO decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted March 1, 2015 Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 Against bringing back the Hardcore champion until they make IC and US titles look prestigious. Dean dealt too much damage to the US title even if it wasn't his fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OPC Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 No. I want a proper Hardcore division. WWE's 24/7 rule didn't even come close to what it could have been and to was always the worst part of any WWE show back in the day. (Mainly followed WCW back then though.) WWE's Hardcore division was serious for years during the late 90s and it was fine until it got stale. So they gave the division that much needed new life with the 24/7 rules and Crash Holly and it worked for a good while. However now I'd say is the time to make it more serious again with guys like Ambrose, Rowan, Harper, Bull Dempesy and some others fighting over it. Keep the falls count anywhere rules in it but no more run ins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowley Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 At WrestleKingdom 9, Jim Ross made a great point. As the co-main event for the Intercontinental title was beginning he something said along the lines of, "why would you want a title in your company that doesn't have the same credibility of any other title? It's illogical." I wish WWE would realize this. That's not to say that NJPW doesn't have titles that are booked poorly or appear less valuable than others, but come on. WWE takes it to a whole other level. Not a single title aside from the WWE World Heavyweight Championship actually matters, and even that one has its problems. Having that been said, I'd much rather see a goofy comedy title for lower card guys than meaningless midcard titles because at least it adds some variety to the show. I think in a lot of ways, WWE's version of hardcore wrestling lends itself more to a PG rated product than TV-14 anyway. Very few hardcore title matches were serious bouts with blood and barbewire. Usually it was stuff like Crash Holly defending the belt at Chuck E Cheese or wherever that was. To me, that's a hell of a lot more entertaining than Dolph Ziggler and Wade Barrett trading a worthless prop back and forth to "give them something to do". I'm really hoping that Cena and Rusev have a good old fashioned feud that lasts a while. I want Cena to eventually win and hold the US title for at least a year. Guys like him and Bryan could do wonders for the midcard titles, especially if they decide to unify them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyriqz ✪ Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 At WrestleKingdom 9, Jim Ross made a great point. As the co-main event for the Intercontinental title was beginning he something along the lines of, "why would you want a title in your company that doesn't have the same credibility of any other title? It's illogical." I wish WWE would realize this. That's not to say that NJPW doesn't have titles that are booked poorly or appear less valuable than others, but come on. WWE takes it to a whole other level. Not a single title aside from the WWE World Heavyweight Championship actually matters, and even that one has its problems. I've been preaching that for the longest but so, so, soooo many people disagreed with it. There's no point in the IC or US title. Even ignoring the poor booking and the worthless titles, just from a logical point of view. Women's/Divas title makes sense, they're a seperate division. Tag Team title makes sense, for tag teams. But a midcard title with no special gimmick or stipulation attached to it? It's *censored*ing retarded. What are they trying to convey with these titles? Ah, you know, there's nothing that sets the champ apart from the WWE champion, except that they aren't as wanted, but I'll go for it because... Yeah, why? Because you're too bad to compete for the big titles? Because that's exactly what the second tier single belts are. Excuses. There's no reason (in kayfabe) to go for that title unless they wanna be champion and know they can't cut it. A hardcore title would make sense, as you'd be the guy who seperates himself from the pack by being the most hardcore guy, carrying a belt to proove it. The cruiserweight title made sense. The X-Division belt in TNA is great too. Sure, it's also clear cut portrayed as below the World title, which kinda degrades self proclaimed X-Division guys but the whole Cash-in concept makes it logical for wrestlers to go for the title and try to bypass the World Title contender ranking. A TV title that has to be defended every week on Raw would be great too. It wouldn't be seen as equal but it would legitimately be the workhouse title, rather than them throwing that cute littler phrase around when refering to the IC title. Make sense, god damn it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OPC Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 John Cena came up through the midcard at a time when those divisions were stacked and that's what people want to see again. I personally don't want to see him be the one to defeat Rusev because it would only give Cena another "amazing" accomplishment while doing nothing for Rusev or any other midcarder in the division. Especially if you keep it on him for longer then a year. I want to see the WWE step it up and put the mid card stars they have to better use and put more focus on the two championships and it'll be just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowley Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 At WrestleKingdom 9, Jim Ross made a great point. As the co-main event for the Intercontinental title was beginning he something along the lines of, "why would you want a title in your company that doesn't have the same credibility of any other title? It's illogical." I wish WWE would realize this. That's not to say that NJPW doesn't have titles that are booked poorly or appear less valuable than others, but come on. WWE takes it to a whole other level. Not a single title aside from the WWE World Heavyweight Championship actually matters, and even that one has its problems. I've been preaching that for the longest but so, so, soooo many people disagreed with it. There's no point in the IC or US title. Even ignoring the poor booking and the worthless titles, just from a logical point of view. Women's/Divas title makes sense, they're a seperate division. Tag Team title makes sense, for tag teams. But a midcard title with no special gimmick or stipulation attached to it? It's *censored*ing retarded. What are they trying to convey with these titles? Ah, you know, there's nothing that sets the champ apart from the WWE champion, except that they aren't as wanted, but I'll go for it because... Yeah, why? Because you're too bad to compete for the big titles? Because that's exactly what the second tier single belts are. Excuses. There's no reason (in kayfabe) to go for that title unless they wanna be champion and know they can't cut it. A hardcore title would make sense, as you'd be the guy who seperates himself from the pack by being the most hardcore guy, carrying a belt to proove it. The cruiserweight title made sense. The X-Division belt in TNA is great too. Sure, it's also clear cut portrayed as below the World title, which kinda degrades self proclaimed X-Division guys but the whole Cash-in concept makes it logical for wrestlers to go for the title and try to bypass the World Title contender ranking. A TV title that has to be defended every week on Raw would be great too. It wouldn't be seen as equal but it would legitimately be the workhouse title, rather than them throwing that cute littler phrase around when refering to the IC title. Make sense, god damn it. Well said. Although one thing that bugged me about the cruiserweight title is that cruiserweights would challenge for heavyweight titles anyway. Another thing that NJPW does better than WWE is weight classes. They've proven that you can have your cake and eat it too. Kota Ibushi is a junior but you want him to challenge for Nakamura's belt? Simple. Just explain that he put on weight for the match. Problem solved in one sentence of commentary. And when WWE is struggling to come up with material every week, instead recycling the phrase "face to face" a million times, why not have weigh-ins? They could actually be exciting if done properly. For example, imagine Daniel Bryan wants to challenge for the heavyweight title, and Triple H tells him he's too small. Instant heat. So you get a few weeks of Daniel Bryan busting his ass in the ring and in training montages. Finally, they have a weigh-in live on Raw. Bryan steps onto electronic scale and the numbers go up. They keep going up until the screen freezes on 218 lbs, just two pounds below the minimum requirement of 220. The crowd gasps in shock and Daniel Bryan quietly pouts. His heavyweight title dreams are shattered. Suddenly, the numbers go up to 220 and the crowd goes wild! It was merely a glitch on the screen. This is just one example. There's a lot they could do with segments like this, but instead they keep rehashing the same cliches. I've seen a lot of fans argue that generic midcard titles are more justified than gimmick titles like the hardcore championship because the novelty wears off quickly. I see where they're coming from, but if the wrestlers are good enough to be a champion, they shouldn't be having repetitive matches. A great example of a gimmick title that didn't get stale was the Florida 15 title. In my opinion, it was one of the coolest titles WWE has ever had. Now that was a "workhorse" title. I really wish NXT would bring it back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEGION Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 At WrestleKingdom 9, Jim Ross made a great point. As the co-main event for the Intercontinental title was beginning he something along the lines of, "why would you want a title in your company that doesn't have the same credibility of any other title? It's illogical." I wish WWE would realize this. That's not to say that NJPW doesn't have titles that are booked poorly or appear less valuable than others, but come on. WWE takes it to a whole other level. Not a single title aside from the WWE World Heavyweight Championship actually matters, and even that one has its problems. I've been preaching that for the longest but so, so, soooo many people disagreed with it. There's no point in the IC or US title. Even ignoring the poor booking and the worthless titles, just from a logical point of view. Women's/Divas title makes sense, they're a seperate division. Tag Team title makes sense, for tag teams. But a midcard title with no special gimmick or stipulation attached to it? It's *censored*ing retarded. What are they trying to convey with these titles? Ah, you know, there's nothing that sets the champ apart from the WWE champion, except that they aren't as wanted, but I'll go for it because... Yeah, why? Because you're too bad to compete for the big titles? Because that's exactly what the second tier single belts are. Excuses. There's no reason (in kayfabe) to go for that title unless they wanna be champion and know they can't cut it. A hardcore title would make sense, as you'd be the guy who seperates himself from the pack by being the most hardcore guy, carrying a belt to proove it. The cruiserweight title made sense. The X-Division belt in TNA is great too. Sure, it's also clear cut portrayed as below the World title, which kinda degrades self proclaimed X-Division guys but the whole Cash-in concept makes it logical for wrestlers to go for the title and try to bypass the World Title contender ranking. A TV title that has to be defended every week on Raw would be great too. It wouldn't be seen as equal but it would legitimately be the workhouse title, rather than them throwing that cute littler phrase around when refering to the IC title. Make sense, god damn it. Well said. Although one thing that bugged me about the cruiserweight title is that cruiserweights would challenge for heavyweight titles anyway. Another thing that NJPW does better than WWE is weight classes. They've proven that you can have your cake and eat it too. Kota Ibushi is a junior but you want him to challenge for Nakamura's belt? Simple. Just explain that he put on weight for the match. Problem solved in one sentence of commentary. And when WWE is struggling to come up with material every week, instead recycling the phrase "face to face" a million times, why not have weigh-ins? They could actually be exciting if done properly. For example, imagine Daniel Bryan wants to challenge for the heavyweight title, and Triple H tells him he's too small. Instant heat. So you get a few weeks of Daniel Bryan busting his ass in the ring and in training montages. Finally, they have a weigh-in live on Raw. Bryan steps onto electronic scale and the numbers go up. They keep going up until the screen freezes on 218 lbs, just two pounds below the minimum requirement of 220. The crowd gasps in shock and Daniel Bryan quietly pouts. His heavyweight title dreams are shattered. Suddenly, the numbers go up to 220 and the crowd goes wild! It was merely a glitch on the screen. This is just one example. There's a lot they could do with segments like this, but instead they keep rehashing the same cliches. I've seen a lot of fans argue that generic midcard titles are more justified than gimmick titles like the hardcore championship because the novelty wears off quickly. I see where they're coming from, but if the wrestlers are good enough to be a champion, they shouldn't be having repetitive matches. A great example of a gimmick title that didn't get stale was the Florida 15 title. In my opinion, it was one of the coolest titles WWE has ever had. Now that was a "workhorse" title. I really wish NXT would bring it back. I agree with all three of these posts. Although I thought differentley about it not so long ago. Another thing that NJPW does well with the belts is the lack of the "Westworld Wrestling"-term "World Title." It's the IWGP Heavyweight Championship. Not the World Heavyweight Championship. It's just a small thing, but it makes the other titles look a lot less like minor championships Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glchitman Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 I'd love to see Miz and Mizdow as the hardcore champion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SryBoutYoDmnLuc Posted March 3, 2015 Report Share Posted March 3, 2015 I'd love to see this hell it would give Ambrose something to do that I don't think WWE could screw up but then again when it comes to Ambrose they managed to mess him up left and right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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