Generations Posted July 21, 2017 Report Share Posted July 21, 2017 I disagree, but whatever. I think it could have still been a suicide mission with heavy emotional weight without all the steps. They tacked on a Vader scene just for some action even though there really wasn't any reason the plans can't have beamed straight into the Tantive. Unless I missed something, the reason for that is obviously because the Tantive was docked inside of Profundity, and Admiral Raddus was in the position to receive the plans...hence why they were beamed to his ship, not the Tantive. Raddus is the one who received the signal when they were asking for someone to take the shield down, and he was the one to download the plans when the shield went down. Makes perfect sense to me. In fact, it would be WAY too convenient for the plans to just go directly where they're needed. He was in the position to receive them, he made the disk, and the disk was then rushed to Leia on the Tantive, which was docked inside of Profundity. If it was docked there, then you surely wouldn't expect the crew to be standing by the command center or awaiting any signals. Vader boarded the Profundity, killed a bunch of people in an attempt to stop the disk from making it from the command center of the Profundity to Leia on the Tantive...but he wasn't quick enough, and it got handed off and made it there. It was a solid scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam the d00d Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Why does everybody call the Death Star having an exhaust port a plothole? Like it almost makes more sense to me that the Empire would look over the exhaust port issue considering it's a virtually impossible shot to make, any fleet attempting to make the shot would be outnumbered, as well as the fact that the Empire thematically are destined to fall as a result of their own ego. That last thing is a recurring aspect of how they are portrayed in the series. If Jyn's dad was going to build a flaw in the Death Star why would he make it nearly impossible to trigger anyway? I understand staying lowkey, but it's the size of a womp rat, if the Rebels didn't have a guy with Jedi DNA in their ranks (which Jyn's dad thought they did not when planning this), it wouldn't have happened anyway. I just think it was a stupid thing to explain that didn't need explained. It actually takes an away an interesting element to how the Empire is portrayed in the original trilogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Than Light Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Because they were perfectly capable of making a Death Star without it (What the finished Death Star II would have been), but they didn't for some reason. Sure it might have fit the Empire's arrogance, but people usually don't take kind to plot induced stupidity. I do agree with you that it didn't necessarily be needed to explained though, and the movie itself wasn't necessary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Since when did so many people complain about "not necessary"? It was meant to be an added treat to hold fans over until Last Jedi can be released. You'd think people would be more appreciative of the effort, rather than complaining that the story didn't need to be told. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepia Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Because oversaturation is a thing. Do we need a movie between every break between main Episodes? It sets a dangerous precedence of Star Wars fatigue. I won't ever 'suffer' from it, but it's a legitimate concern. Also a lot of people have complained about the necessity of Rogue One, ever since it's announcement. It's been a rather common complaint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Than Light Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 I liked it, but yeah. I appericate the effort, expanding on some new canon stuff, but it was unnecessary. We really didn't need a hold over till the Last Jedi I would have liked to see Rogue One done in a novel or a 1 season tv series. They could do so much more with in those mediums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepia Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Yeah that's why games like Call of Duty and Assassins Creed got stale, because they're released once a year with little substance to differentiate between the titles. If Star Wars feels the need to "tide over" their fans by releasing a spin off between every major movie then it could very easily fall into that same staleness like those games (and some movie franchises.) I have no problem with Rogue One, it was a good and fun popcorn flick and I've accepted it as such, but there are problems with it and the argument of "was it necessary?" Is a credible one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNX Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Rogue One as a series probably would've been perfect. It would've aided the complaints about character development by giving everyone ample time to be fleshed out before the series conclusion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senex Beast Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 It was unnecessary but I for one appreciated and liked it. I agree that it should have been a TV series, novel or video game but still had a great time at a movie theater watching it (I rarely go to movie theaters now) and it's rewatchable at home. Not as much as the original trilogy and Force Awakens but way more than the prequels and especially the first two episodes. I actually like the prequels to an extent but just not as much higher as the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam the d00d Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Because they were perfectly capable of making a Death Star without it (What the finished Death Star II would have been), but they didn't for some reason. Sure it might have fit the Empire's arrogance, but people usually don't take kind to plot induced stupidity. I do agree with you that it didn't necessarily be needed to explained though, and the movie itself wasn't necessary I always just figured the Death Star II was built differently from the first one. Having done it once they could make improvements from there. And it's a shame that people don't watch these things and consider what qualities the Empire as a whole carry on screen. I'm just into the more thematic things going on with the original movies moreso than anything else. I just think people have too much of a fetish for surface level stuff like aesthetics in Star Wars. Like people really have a boner for the Empire because they look cool. So much so that they don't want to admit they're flawed. Same goes with Boba Fett. They worship this guy who is a *censored*ing joke because "ooh cool helmet". And they write EU idol-worship pieces about these people to make them have no flaws and to make them as badass as possible. That's why I have an issue with the Rogue One Vader scene in the context of the original films. If this was a slasher movie or something like Predator that scene would have worked. But instead it's within a movie that's reaching towards a feeling of hope, but they frame this Vader scene like he's cool. Like it's purpose is for the audience to feel like Vader's awesome instead of Vader being the normal tragic figure. They just let him go apeshit on some nameless characters so the audience will feel as little emotional connection to these poor bastards being ruthlessly murdered as possible. It's so tonedeaf. It's pure fanwankery that used to be mainly reserved to the EU shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeM Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Because they were perfectly capable of making a Death Star without it (What the finished Death Star II would have been), but they didn't for some reason. I thought the DS II would have had the same port, but was defended by the shield from Endor? The second Death Star was basically just a bigger version of the first wasn't it? The only reason the Rebels went to destroy it via the reactor core, was because it was unfinished and there was wide open access. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Than Light Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Because they were perfectly capable of making a Death Star without it (What the finished Death Star II would have been), but they didn't for some reason. I thought the DS II would have had the same port, but was defended by the shield from Endor? The second Death Star was basically just a bigger version of the first wasn't it? The only reason the Rebels went to destroy it via the reactor core, was because it was unfinished and there was wide open access. Though designed to be very similar in appearance and function to the first Death Star, the second Death Star improved on its predecessor's design by incorporating millions of millimeter-sized heat-dispersion tubes in place of the two-meter-wide thermal exhaust port exploited by the Rebel Alliance at the Battle of Yavin. That's from the canon-version of the DS starwars wikia page And the shield was projected from Endor. If the DSII left the system, it couldn't be protected by the shield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeM Posted July 22, 2017 Report Share Posted July 22, 2017 Though designed to be very similar in appearance and function to the first Death Star, the second Death Star improved on its predecessor's design by incorporating millions of millimeter-sized heat-dispersion tubes in place of the two-meter-wide thermal exhaust port exploited by the Rebel Alliance at the Battle of Yavin. That's from the canon-version of the DS starwars wikia page And the shield was projected from Endor. If the DSII left the system, it couldn't be protected by the shield. Ah thanks. Actually that had never occurred to me - suppose the shield was merely temporary to protect the unfinished project. They'd probably dispose of the shield generator by using Endor as a test once it was completed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam the d00d Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 No matter what way you cut it, it still doesn't seem like a plot hole to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepia Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 No matter what way you cut it, it still doesn't seem like a plot hole to me. Yeah me either. It was a plot device, a mcguffin. Not a plot hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted July 25, 2017 Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 Either way, I'm really open for the idea of more of these "smaller" 'Star Wars Story' films. I was skeptical about the first one just because it seemed like it would be this completely pointless thing...but it really has added to the lore, IMO. And I'll gladly watch a bunch more of these films with new characters and lore. The fact that they can be completely different and not tied to what is happening in the main franchise is really appealing to me. Would be fun to learn more about Darth Maul, or go back to Hoth, or whatever...it really seems like an open-ended book now. Rather than having "this is your trilogy, and this is it"...we now have the option for whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senex Beast Posted July 25, 2017 Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 Yup. Agreed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam the d00d Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 Personally, I think I got enough of Darth Maul in the Clone Wars series which generally gives you a pretty solid idea of his backstory and the culture he comes from. I'd just prefer if they were to do these standalone movies, which I'm not really a fan of the idea of in the way they're currently doing them, that they completely deviate from what we know. No part of me wants to watch a film centered on Han Solo. The original trilogy gives me my Han Solo fix, Han Solo has his character arc in there and to me it's satisfactory. I'm not interested in going back at all. Instead it'd be cool to just see some completely original film that just happens to take place in a Star Wars setting. Where the consequences have no impact on the main series films. They have this giant universe to play with yet everytime I see ideas for stand alone films it's always dealing with the same set of 20 or so characters that are preexisting. It seems with Lord and Miller getting the axe that Disney wants these movies to all be very in sync with one and other, which to me defeats the appeal of a stand alone Star Wars movie. I'd be more interested in a variety of Star Wars movies that are tonally all over the place with vastly different styles of directing. My ideal stand alone movie would have a completely new cast or characters that exists outside of the Rebels or the Empire. Maybe we see the effects the war has on their way of life, but they aren't active participants. And these characters and their story would be the driving force of the film. Not some pre-established Star Wars thing that's attached to the plot. And ideally it'd have it's own identity, as far as direction goes, compared to the other films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 Personally, I think I got enough of Darth Maul in the Clone Wars series which generally gives you a pretty solid idea of his backstory and the culture he comes from. Didn't watch that, don't plan on watching that...and if it doesn't happen in a real movie with real people, then it doesn't count/matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepia Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 Well it does matter and is considered canon alongside the movies. So what you say doesn't mean anything. How *censored*ing ignorant can one person be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam the d00d Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 Personally, I think I got enough of Darth Maul in the Clone Wars series which generally gives you a pretty solid idea of his backstory and the culture he comes from. Didn't watch that, don't plan on watching that...and if it doesn't happen in a real movie with real people, then it doesn't count/matter. Well if they ever do include Darth Maul again the films again they are going to have to adhere by the rules portrayed in the cartoon so it sort of does count as it stands currently. Canon doesn't really matter though if you don't want it to. Some people wouldn't consider Episode 7 or Rogue One or Rebels canon since Lucas had no involvement. People should just follow whatever canon they're into, whether it's official Lucasfilm canon or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 Well it does matter and is considered canon alongside the movies. So what you say doesn't mean anything. How *censored*ing ignorant can one person be? Not ignorant. Facts. It can be canon all it wants. But, I guarantee you, a mere fraction of the fanbase that watch the actual movies took the time to watch it. Hence, yeah...it doesn't *censored*ing matter unless it's in a main movie with real actors. I never said that there was a lack of backstory for Darth Maul, or that no one knew anything about him. I said that the actual movies could use some additional footage of him. Just because die hard Star Wars fans took the time to watch an animated kids movie, and that movie happened to talk more about Darth Maul, hardly means that your average fan has had their fill of that character. Stop trying to talk shit about me in every post you make, with no goddamn warrant for it. It was a simple statement...it doesn't matter unless it happens in a real movie. I stand by it. It isn't ignorance. The main draw of Star Wars are the main movies. I'd be willing to bet that even most die hard fans of the franchise were hardly satisfied with a computer animated/cartoon version of Darth Maul, and would be much happier seeing his badassery on the silver screen once again. Well if they ever do include Darth Maul again the films again they are going to have to adhere by the rules portrayed in the cartoon so it sort of does count as it stands currently. And this is fine. Because they can always jump to a point before or after that story, and show whatever they want of Darth Maul. Not having watched it, I don't know what "rules" you're referring to...but I'm sure there is plenty of wiggle room to tell a different story involving DM without overstepping any bounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepia Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 I wasn't starting shit with you just because, you need to stop jumping to that assumption. I disagreed with something you said so I posted about it. I would have said the same shit to everyone else. You're concocting you're own vendetta in you're own mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 I wasn't starting shit with you just because, you need to stop jumping to that assumption. I disagreed with something you said so I posted about it. I would have said the same shit to everyone else. You're concocting you're own vendetta in you're own mind. It's not the disagreement. It's the statement about ignorance. Nothing that I said was ignorant. It was a personal opinion about seeing a character in a movie, and the bit about the animated movie not mattering was a perfectly fair claim as well (explained in my last post). Maybe you should choose your words more carefully. Maybe we wouldn't be having arguments all the time. Maybe it's you...and the way that you address people with disrespect constantly. I already know that you've said in the past that you view me as the type of person who thinks that nothing I say is wrong, and I already know that you've called me ignorant a number of times in the past. So, excuse me for taking offense when I see a statement like that. Because, I do consider it shit-stirring based on past statements made by you. It's not some elaborate scheme that I've concocted in my own mind...it's just being familiar with your posting habits and the way that you address people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam the d00d Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 Ackshawlly it's a television show and not a movie. And strangely enough, the later seasons were noticeably less kid friendly than any of the movies for the most part. Pong Krell arc would have probably been my favorite Star Wars thing after the original trilogy had they not completely dropped the ball with the ending. The ending doesn't ruin everything that happened prior to it though. Clone Wars was really the first to show how *censored*ed up the war really was in detail. Which is why I was wondering why diehards who I know had watched the show were crediting Rogue One with that when Clone Wars not only did it first, but did it better. I just wanted an excuse to rave about Clone Wars it gets way too much shit mainly because the movie and the first two seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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