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Not sure if this is the place for it, but someone just shot up a tram in Utrecht, The Netherlands and they assume it's an terrorist attack. It's easy to draw conclusions with this happening so soon after the terrorist attacks in New Zealand.

3 dead, 9 injured confirmed now.

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Tis the season I guess. After the Raul Brazil school shooting, that's three international majors in 6 days. Crime in Brazil is well documented but there's a bit of a rarity for school shootings.

 

The Brazilian President is a pretty fresh face in office, got sworn in in Jan, and wasted no time signing a decree to make gun acquisition easier (I cant tell if it's already in effect though). He's amongst the mind set of "arm the good guys to stop the bad guys". So their legal age of acquisition is 25, you need proof of residency and stable income, no criminal history, pass a psych eval and undergo gun training, but he extended the registration renewal period to 10 years from 5 and removed the requirement of stating exactly why you need the weapon and the police have to agree and sign off on that statement. Supposedly that portion of the policy has always been one of most important.

 

I dunno if those changes affected the outcome of the shooting as the older of the two (yeah, it was two friends) was 25 and they'd plan the attack for over a year, plus the gun was acquired legally *shrugs*

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Not sure if this is the place for it, but someone just shot up a tram in Utrecht, The Netherlands and they assume it's an terrorist attack. It's easy to draw conclusions with this happening so soon after the terrorist attacks in New Zealand.

This is so sad. Too many killings in this world for no reason.

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So how about that massive military style weapon ban and buyback in New Zealand? Now everybody side eyeing the U.S. Pressure is on

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Because it's so much better to live in a country that allows mass shootings to happen, even in schools, and do nothing about guns even though they can reduce gun homicide. Sometimes I wonder if republicans make USA look like a joke.

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Makes me glad I don't live in New Zealand.

I'm sure they're glad to not have you.

 

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Makes me glad there's a whole ocean seperating us. Why are you against preventing things like tis happening again?

This is why I have a hard time debating guns on here. Not because I dislike the conversation. Not because I'm against difference of opinion. But because I have a different opinion I'm now either labeled as gun obsessed or against trying to stop mass shootings. If anyone wants to know my stances on gun control you can either look through previous threads or ask me a real question.

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Makes me glad I don't live in New Zealand.

I'm sure they're glad to not have you.

tenor.gif?itemid=5850917

Makes me glad there's a whole ocean seperating us. Why are you against preventing things like tis happening again?

This is why I have a hard time debating guns on here. Not because I dislike the conversation. Not because I'm against difference of opinion. But because I have a different opinion I'm now either labeled as gun obsessed or against trying to stop mass shootings. If anyone wants to know my stances on gun control you can either look through previous threads or ask me a real question.

Well what suggestions do you have to stop mass shootings? Taking away items that are only designed to damage and injure seems like the smartest cause of action. What reason do people have to own military grade assault rifles? With knifes you can't do long range attacks. Maybe if you throw it at someone but even then yu can't do that to multiple people in quick sucession like you can a gun.

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You literally posted

Makes me glad I don't live in New Zealand.

in response to stricter gun laws

 

In response to a government acting emotionally and irrationally to a scumbag who acted irrationally and emotionally.

 

Well what suggestions do you have to stop mass shootings? Taking away items that are only designed to damage and injure seems like the smartest cause of action. What reason do people have to own military grade assault rifles? With knifes you can't do long range attacks. Maybe if you throw it at someone but even then yu can't do that to multiple people in quick sucession like you can a gun.

Are we talking about just New Zealand or the United States? We can do both if you want but lets go with New Zealand first. In New Zealand there were 1.2 million registered guns in 2017. That same year there were 35 murders according to USA Today. The majority of those murders did not involve a gun. This tells me that despite this being a horrible incident, it is a rare occurrence. That the heavy majority of people in New Zealand can be trusted with guns and that you'd be completely safe around those people.

 

Likewise the person who acted out this shooting had a valid gun license. But the guns used had been illegally upgraded. In other words, this guy did not follow the gun laws in place. And I'm sure he would not have followed any new gun laws implemented either.

 

This guy was a white supremacist. New Zealand can obviously do whatever they want but based on the statistics given. I'd work on going after that type of thinking, as opposed to the guns which cause very few deaths there.

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Dude...are we really going back to the "murders happen daily without guns" rhetoric?

 

The point is, an automatic weapon can kill a massive group of people instantly. 50 people dead...with the squeeze of a trigger. That's a tragedy. It's never good when anyone is murdered...but, the amount of people affected by a large scale shooting greatly outweighs what happens when you you're talking about those individual murders. You're talking about shattering a community in minutes.

 

30 random people being murdered in the US, sprinkled all around the nation, is not the same as an entire community being wiped out in one act. Brothers and sisters, mothers and fathers, neighbors, friends. The only way to kill that many people is with an explosive device, or with an automatic weapon. One of those is illegal. The other definitely should be. End of.

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Dude...are we really going back to the "murders happen daily without guns" rhetoric?

 

The point is, an automatic weapon can kill a massive group of people instantly. 50 people dead...with the squeeze of a trigger. That's a tragedy. It's never good when anyone is murdered...but, the amount of people affected by a large scale shooting greatly outweighs what happens when you you're talking about those individual murders. You're talking about shattering a community in minutes.

 

The only way to kill that many people is with an explosive device, or with an automatic weapon. One of those is illegal. The other definitely should be. End of.

Exactly. Think of a group of 100 people. You give me a knife or a blunt object like a crowbar, I may be able to seriously injure a few, but the majority will get away and there is a high chance they may even be able to take me down themselves. You give me a gun however, I can seriously injure or even kill the vast majority of them very, very quickly. Hell, I'd go as far as to say explosive devices have more right being legal than guns. At least with them you need the element of surprise for them to be effective. Not that either should be legsl of course.

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Also...now I that I read that post again...what you said becomes even more absurd.

 

35 murders in a year? That obviously pertains to premeditated murder...like, serial killer shit. The number of gun deaths in the US in a year is about 40,000 from what I can tell. Whatever agenda exists that keeps gun deaths from being called "murder" does not change the true numbers here...

 

 

Gun-lovers seem to have a real problem with calling things what they are...

 

Shooting = murder

Mass shooting = terrorism

White supremacist = terrorist

 

And so on...

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Also...now I that I read that post again...what you said becomes even more absurd.

 

35 murders in a year? That obviously pertains to premeditated murder...like, cereal killer shit. The number of gun deaths in the US in a year is about 40,000 from what I can tell. Whatever agenda exists that keeps gun deaths from being called "murder" does not change the true numbers here...

I don't know how spoons come into this. :lol:

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30 random people being murdered in the US, sprinkled all around the nation, is not the same as an entire community being wiped out in one act. Brothers and sisters, mothers and fathers, neighbors, friends. The only way to kill that many people is with an explosive device, or with an automatic weapon. One of those is illegal. The other definitely should be. End of.

 

Perhaps I'm confused by what your saying. But do you think those 35 murders are in regards to the USA? I said it came from a "USA Today" article. There were less than 35 gun related murders in New Zealand in 2017.

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2019/03/15/mass-shootings-rare-new-zealand/3172278002/

 

Statistically guns are not an issue in that country.

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Guns weren't banned, assault rifles and semi-automatics were. It means you can still legally own a handgun, just not assault rifles. This is something USA should do, as well as pass stricter gun control laws nationwide instead of just letting NY and another state do it. I can't be assed, but I think there are studies that say deaths by gun is higher in states with lax gun control than it is in states with stricter gun control.

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35 gun deaths the whole year? Damn cuz, if only...

 

I mentioned in the mass shooting thread awhile back that when you take away something like this, people just want it more. It's gonna be at the expense of many innocents unfortunately but im curious to see if that number grows after the buyback period ends. It's such an isolated innocent that it may not do much in the grand scheme of things to simply ban some weapons.

 

Military grade/style weapons and "assault rifles" aren't the only potential semi auto firearms out there. I think the clip limit helps the law out but like it's been said, the guns are tweaked in illegal ways that make them more dangerous. You can tweak non military style weapons to do the same scaled dangerous sheeit. So if it took somebody 23 years to do something this devastating in that area with the laws currently in place, changing them like this doesn't guarantee another serene 23 years. It just pisses off a bunch of gun owners

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