maskedmaniac Posted January 29, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 think we are vastly overestimating Biden here. corp/centrist dems lose power everyday. AOC is a shining example of how win with leftist ideas and there are many more out there. i dont see Biden being anything but Hillary with a warmer personality. he is of the brand of democrat that panic and move to the right when its crunch time and thats how they continue to lose.Biden is a good debater and was the VP for Obama who Democrats still love and you know Obama would help him campaign. I'll easily put my money on him if he runs. AOC won in NY, not exactly a challenge. I'd take the liberal who almost won against Cruz in Texas over her if I'm a democrat. Beto? AOC and Beto aren't ready for Presidency yet. Neither was Trump yet millions of Americans still voted for him. Speaking of Cheetoh Man, it's about time he starts coming up with names for all of these new candidates. Wonder what name he has in store for Kamala Harris or Beto Orourke? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1090074254010404864 this twat would be so funny if he weren't *censored*ing this country and our future up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEGION Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1090074254010404864 this twat would be so funny if he weren't *censored*ing this country and our future up Saw this is in the responses and it's perfect And there is a typo in his tweet as well. How did you Americans let it get this far? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nWo_Kevin Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Biden is a good debater and was the VP for Obama who Democrats still love and you know Obama would help him campaign. I'll easily put my money on him if he runs. AOC won in NY, not exactly a challenge. I'd take the liberal who almost won against Cruz in Texas over her if I'm a democrat. Beto? AOC and Beto aren't ready for Presidency yet. Beto is much closer of the two. AOC is the democratic version of Trump. Both blame the media for everything. Neither know what the 3 branches of government are. etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EJ! Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 AOC navigates through media way better than Trump does. I never see her complain much about the media but with the fashion in which Fox News is on her nuts she has every right. https://twitter.com/nowthisnews/status/1090226301674377220?s=21 also the fact that people panicked when she proposed the 70% top marginal tax rate because many media outlets forget to mention the part where the majority of the country wouldnt be affected by that because itll only kick in when you make more than $10M. you cant tell me any lefty has been giving a solid chance to present their ideas without republicans and even centrist dems and libs sensationalizing bits and pieces of it. AOC and Bernie types would take over the country if people more powerful werent scared of actual change and if the media gave everyone a fair shake. even during the primaries, Trump and Hillary ate up TV time which goes to show who was being propped up before voters even decided. https://twitter.com/nowthisnews/status/1090143254396297216?s=21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Looks like everyone to the left of center will be handing 2020 to Trump, given no one can agree on a candidate. Shame because any Democrat candidate is better than a Republican one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Looks like everyone to the left of center will be handing 2020 to Trump, given no one can agree on a candidate. Shame because any Democrat candidate is better than a Republican one. It's still early. If they say "get Trump tf out of here", then I think we can get people to agree on someone. I already refuse to care who the dem picks are. I'm just going with whoever has the best chance. I'll know who that is when the time arrives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 I'm not sure because some don't see some candidates as any better. Harris being pro-prison and pro-cop's hurting her. Not sure about Sanders but I think there's butthurt there. Clinton is just a shitty choice. Problem is, Republicans have no need to worry about votes because they focus on power, not who. People to the left of the center are worrying more about the who. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Like I said..people need to get on the "better than Trump" boat this time around. There is no "I like this person more than the other"...there can't be. Make this election about getting Trump tf out of there. Let the next election be about picking a person who aligns with your ideals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNX Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Looks like everyone to the left of center will be handing 2020 to Trump, given no one can agree on a candidate. Shame because any Democrat candidate is better than a Republican one. Naaaaaaaw, lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted January 29, 2019 Report Share Posted January 29, 2019 Like I said..people need to get on the "better than Trump" boat this time around. There is no "I like this person more than the other"...there can't be. Make this election about getting Trump tf out of there. Let the next election be about picking a person who aligns with your ideals. To a lot of them though, what's the point if that person won't be that much better than Trump when it comes to social issues? Looks like everyone to the left of center will be handing 2020 to Trump, given no one can agree on a candidate. Shame because any Democrat candidate is better than a Republican one. Naaaaaaaw, lmao Oh true, I forgot there can be conservative Dems. Well then, anyone to the left of center is a better candidate than the right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maskedmaniac Posted January 30, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 More like any candidate is better than Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generations Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EJ! Posted January 30, 2019 Report Share Posted January 30, 2019 simply running on being being better than Trump is pretty much exactly what Hillary did. it doesnt work. the midterm elections proved this as well, many of the dems who didnt do much to separate themselves from their republican opponent simply lost. meanwhile a good handful of states where actual progressives were given a chance either won or came really close. running on being anti-Trump assumes everyone thinks hes bad which clearly isnt true. im not even just talking about his base, im also talking about the people who acknowledge how shitty a person he is and may not like it, but they vote for him anyway because he best represents their ideals. there are likely more of those people than the MAGAs. those are the people you want to appeal to. its easy to shit on Trump, you gotta explain why you are better than him for American people. cant assume because hes a bad man that people know better than to vote for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nWo_Kevin Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 simply running on being being better than Trump is pretty much exactly what Hillary did. it doesnt work. the midterm elections proved this as well, many of the dems who didnt do much to separate themselves from their republican opponent simply lost. meanwhile a good handful of states where actual progressives were given a chance either won or came really close. running on being anti-Trump assumes everyone thinks hes bad which clearly isnt true. im not even just talking about his base, im also talking about the people who acknowledge how shitty a person he is and may not like it, but they vote for him anyway because he best represents their ideals. there are likely more of those people than the MAGAs. those are the people you want to appeal to. its easy to shit on Trump, you gotta explain why you are better than him for American people. cant assume because hes a bad man that people know better than to vote for him. Well said and I’ve argued this for a while. If you think simply being Anti-Trump is going to win you anything, good luck. You’ll only strengthen his support and unite his supporters. Democrats need to argue why they are better, what ideas they have for this country. Even though this forum is pretty liberal and everyone thinks Trump is evil. The republican party can just as easily argue that democrats are for open borders, high taxes, and later term abortions including during active labor (no one talking about what happened in Virginia?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNX Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 Not sure if there's much to say. The outrage bascially revolves around whether or not the physician believes the mother is at risk. It's not just "so, I think this baby is coming tomorrow and I'm done using it to get pity and free sheeit, so you can kill it now" and they're like "*points* you got it lady! One dead baby, coming up!" It was just lowering the number of people required to make the call that it's dangerous for the mother and allowed the procedure to be performed in more places. It's not like third term abortions aren't already a thing in VA. Please correct me if it goes beyond that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted January 31, 2019 Report Share Posted January 31, 2019 The outrage is from hypocritical conservatives who either lie or believe lies. NY passed a law that let women up to 24 weeks pregnant get an abortion, but anytime after that they'd need doctor's approval and it'd have to be necessary. Conservatives are full of shit and claiming that women can get abortion a week or two before estimated due date if they wanted, which would make no sense. Why would pregnant women carry that long if they don't want the baby? in any case, conservatives need to start caring about lives that already exist, not pretend to care about fetuses that can't live outside the womb. https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/virginia-governor-ralph-northam-late-term-abortion_us_5c534527e4b043e25b1a5cb3 The ironic thing about Trump commenting on this is that he supposedly wanted one of his daughters aborted. Actually, I'm willing to bet Republican politicians would be okay with abortions if their mistresses ever got pregnant. This is exactly why I don't trust almost anything republicans say, or even conservative leaning sources. Anyway, EJ put it perfectly. The Democrats need to start arguing why they're better, not use anti-Trump as a platform or try to be hip to connect to millennials. They got Cardi B to speak, if I recall correctly, which is dumb. While there are some people who'd vote Democrat just to prevent Trump from getting power again, there are many more who likely wouldn't vote or are neutral. Democrats need to go after those people and convince them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nWo_Kevin Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 Not sure if there's much to say. The outrage bascially revolves around whether or not the physician believes the mother is at risk. It's not just "so, I think this baby is coming tomorrow and I'm done using it to get pity and free sheeit, so you can kill it now" and they're like "*points* you got it lady! One dead baby, coming up!" It was just lowering the number of people required to make the call that it's dangerous for the mother and allowed the procedure to be performed in more places. It's not like third term abortions aren't already a thing in VA. Please correct me if it goes beyond that So theres two parts to this. The first part is about Virginia Democratic Delegate Kathy Tran proposed legislation late last week in Virginia's House of Delegates that would allow abortions up until the moment of birth. Democrats back legislation to reduce the number of doctors required to certify late-term abortions from three to one. It also would delete the words “substantially and irremediably” when referring to the threat that continuing a pregnancy poses for impairing a woman’s health. Note this doesn't have to be physical health. This doesn't have to be "OMG the mothers going to die" health. It could also be....mental health. When Republican Gilbert and Democrat Tran discussed this, he pushed her to explain further. Heres the transcript: Republican Gilbert: Where its obvious a woman is about to give birth, that she has physical signs that shes about to give birth. Would that be a point at which she could request an abortion if she was so certified....she's dilating. Tran: Mr. Chairman, that would be a decision that the doctor, the physician and the woman would make at that point. GIlbert: I understand that. I'm asking if your bill allows that. Tran: My bill would allow that. So despite what M3J said, YES, if this democratic bill was passed, a woman COULD not only get an abortion a week or two before birth. But could get an abortion right before birth. So essentially she would be killing a baby and then giving birth to said dead baby. ----------------------------------------- Then you have Virginia’s Democratic Gov. Ralph Northam, which M3J posted his link about. He was asked about Trans comments. And said: "I can tell you exactly what would happen, the infant would be delivered, the infant would be kept comfortable, the infant would be resuscitated if this is what the mother and the family desired, and then a discussion would ensue between the physician and the mother." So my initial reading of that and what people are concerned about is: The baby is alive, everyone leaves the room and the doctor and mother decide. Should we resuscitate this baby? Should we kill it? And thats concerning when added to what Tran said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 She can only get an abortion if it is not viable to carry to term or if there's any danger to her. Why would an expecting mother wait for months to get abortion when she can get it in the first trimester and get it over with? Wonder if the choice to save the baby stems from wanting to spare it any potential complication or difficult life if it survives but with brain damage or something. Interesting thing is, despite conservatives claiming abortion is murder, they defend abuse and murder of migrant kids, say nothing about USA killing pregnant moms and babies in Middle East, are against increasing minimum wage for families, and hate welfares, especially the ones that can help babies. Republicans won't back up their talk, and it's funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango kid Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 So the largest amount of fentanyl ever was seize today coming over an legal Port of entry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maskedmaniac Posted February 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 The outrage is from hypocritical conservatives who either lie or believe lies. NY passed a law that let women up to 24 weeks pregnant get an abortion, but anytime after that they'd need doctor's approval and it'd have to be necessary. Conservatives are full of shit and claiming that women can get abortion a week or two before estimated due date if they wanted, which would make no sense. Why would pregnant women carry that long if they don't want the baby? in any case, conservatives need to start caring about lives that already exist, not pretend to care about fetuses that can't live outside the womb. https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/virginia-governor-ralph-northam-late-term-abortion_us_5c534527e4b043e25b1a5cb3 The ironic thing about Trump commenting on this is that he supposedly wanted one of his daughters aborted. Actually, I'm willing to bet Republican politicians would be okay with abortions if their mistresses ever got pregnant. This is exactly why I don't trust almost anything republicans say, or even conservative leaning sources. Anyway, EJ put it perfectly. The Democrats need to start arguing why they're better, not use anti-Trump as a platform or try to be hip to connect to millennials. They got Cardi B to speak, if I recall correctly, which is dumb. While there are some people who'd vote Democrat just to prevent Trump from getting power again, there are many more who likely wouldn't vote or are neutral. Democrats need to go after those people and convince them. The real irony here is that if Trump, and so many of these die-hard pro-lifers had been aborted we probably wouldn't be having this conversation and the world as a whole would be a better place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNX Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 She can only get an abortion if it is not viable to carry to term or if there's any danger to her. Why would an expecting mother wait for months to get abortion when she can get it in the first trimester and get it over with? Wonder if the choice to save the baby stems from wanting to spare it any potential complication or difficult life if it survives but with brain damage or something. He can correct me on this too, but the interview pieces he quoted made it seem like at the very moment a woman is about to give birth, any massive change in psyche could grant her abortion request if she were to make one right then and there and the doctor agreed it was a good or necessary move. It's not about her mindset in the months leading up to the delivery. It's the worst-case scenario of her not being mentally fit to either deliver or possibly care for it after the fact? And I don't even consider that a realistic case but crazier things have happened The decision to not resuscitate a newborn has to be ridiculous levels of life threatening for me to be down with that. It's like you said, is their major concern at that point the ease of way of life for the infant or are they still looking at the mother's mentality. I always figure if they made it this far, I think they deserve a shot unless they come out looking like the Witcher 3 botchling and, still, that's a mutual agreement the mother/family, physician, and doctor has to agree with. I'm sure most pro lifers are for the "birth at conception" concept, so killing an embryo is no different from not resuscitating a newborn, even though you're making an active effort to end life with the seed, yet not doing anything to save the baby is also seen as an active effort to end life. These medical professionals I'd like to think are capable of making an educated decision to end a child's life. As long as they ultimately have the say, I still don't see the bill as an issue personally, though I understand the outrage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M3J Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 She can only get an abortion if it is not viable to carry to term or if there's any danger to her. Why would an expecting mother wait for months to get abortion when she can get it in the first trimester and get it over with? Wonder if the choice to save the baby stems from wanting to spare it any potential complication or difficult life if it survives but with brain damage or something. He can correct me on this too, but the interview pieces he quoted made it seem like at the very moment a woman is about to give birth, any massive change in psyche could grant her abortion request if she were to make one right then and there and the doctor agreed it was a good or necessary move. It's not about her mindset in the months leading up to the delivery. It's the worst-case scenario of her not being mentally fit to either deliver or possibly care for it after the fact? And I don't even consider that a realistic case but crazier things have happened The decision to not resuscitate a newborn has to be ridiculous levels of life threatening for me to be down with that. It's like you said, is their major concern at that point the ease of way of life for the infant or are they still looking at the mother's mentality. I always figure if they made it this far, I think they deserve a shot unless they come out looking like the Witcher 3 botchling and, still, that's a mutual agreement the mother/family, physician, and doctor has to agree with. I'm sure most pro lifers are for the "birth at conception" concept, so killing an embryo is no different from not resuscitating a newborn, even though you're making an active effort to end life with the seed, yet not doing anything to save the baby is also seen as an active effort to end life. These medical professionals I'd like to think are capable of making an educated decision to end a child's life. As long as they ultimately have the say, I still don't see the bill as an issue personally, though I understand the outrage It's possible, but would the doctors allow that? They'd insist on her delivering the baby. I've heard stories from few women on how the doctors did more damage to them by not doing anything that could remove their ability to make babies at the expense of losing their lives. I dunno if this makes sense, but the doctors were more concerned for the women's ability to reproduce than they were for the women's lives. Personally, if the mother is conscious, it should be her decision alone, not her family's. She's the one who has to go through childbirth and everything. I do hope though that they'll try to keep the baby alive unless it's not viable somehow. Pro-lifer is a myth, no one is a pro-lifer. To be a pro-lifer, one would have to actually be against killing of any kind, and conservatives are okay with murder. To get back on topic though, I do hope the medical professionals make the right decisions or at least, talk to the moms and encourage them to make the right decisions. THe outrage is silly though. So the largest amount of fentanyl ever was seize today coming over an legal Port of entry https://twitter.com/RabbiJill/status/1091036542682902528 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNX Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 It's possible, but would the doctors allow that? They'd insist on her delivering the baby. I've heard stories from few women on how the doctors did more damage to them by not doing anything that could remove their ability to make babies at the expense of losing their lives. I dunno if this makes sense, but the doctors were more concerned for the women's ability to reproduce than they were for the women's lives.Those sound like bad doctors, the kinds you don't want making these kinds of decisions, but only if they're unaware of the issues the child birth could cause the mother. For every cluster of stories you may have heard about choosing the baby over the mother, if given the opportunity some doctor will choose the mother over the infant. I wouldn't envy anyone in the position to make that decision, especially when the time is running out to make it. As for the Fentanyl, how can you expect to make money off a drug that kills you with a few grains? You want something that'll keep you coming back, not off you, wtf. AND THE WEIGHT, good lord LMAO. Glad we got some border Patrol with their eyes open. Tell DT to get more of them and you won't need the damn wall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nWo_Kevin Posted February 1, 2019 Report Share Posted February 1, 2019 He can correct me on this too, but the interview pieces he quoted made it seem like at the very moment a woman is about to give birth, any massive change in psyche could grant her abortion request if she were to make one right then and there and the doctor agreed it was a good or necessary move. It's not about her mindset in the months leading up to the delivery. It's the worst-case scenario of her not being mentally fit to either deliver or possibly care for it after the fact? And I don't even consider that a realistic case but crazier things have happened The decision to not resuscitate a newborn has to be ridiculous levels of life threatening for me to be down with that. It's like you said, is their major concern at that point the ease of way of life for the infant or are they still looking at the mother's mentality. I always figure if they made it this far, I think they deserve a shot unless they come out looking like the Witcher 3 botchling and, still, that's a mutual agreement the mother/family, physician, and doctor has to agree with. I'm sure most pro lifers are for the "birth at conception" concept, so killing an embryo is no different from not resuscitating a newborn, even though you're making an active effort to end life with the seed, yet not doing anything to save the baby is also seen as an active effort to end life. These medical professionals I'd like to think are capable of making an educated decision to end a child's life. As long as they ultimately have the say, I still don't see the bill as an issue personally, though I understand the outrage I might start rambling here so please bare with me. I try not to let frustration get to me when talking on here but its hard with this topic. If I understand what you're saying then yes, you'd be correct. Any mindset change could technically lead to an abortion. Essentially what the bill proposed was "Abortion on demand" but now you can claim its any kind of mental or physical health issue and it would be approved. Crazy? Maybe. Happens? I'm sure of it. I think the other thing I found disturbing about what Northam said, in a part before what I quoted. He talked about if the baby was going to be deformed (which you'd know well before anyway) and my response would be.....so what? Or maybe like M3J said, what if the baby has brain damage. And again my response would be.....so what? Do those who have special needs lives not matter? Does a baby who might grow up to be deformed...does he/she's life not matter? Are they not good enough to be born? To have a shot, like you said in another post. And in regards to your other post, the 3rd paragraph. For me personally, while I disagree with it, I can at least understand where you or someone might come from when you talk about the baby just being an embryo. I might not be ok with it, but it makes sense. But when a baby is ready to be born or already born? The debate is over. If a baby's cord is cut from their mother....that's a human. That's a life. The mother should no longer be allowed to decide if they die or not. The doctor should do everything in their power to make sure the baby lives, until they no longer can. Not have a conversation about it or ask the mother first (who is probably on some pretty sure medication at this point anyway and not thinking with the clearest mind). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.