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The Metal Gauntlet - Preview and rules thread.

Metal Gauntlet music tournament

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#21 unknownsold13r

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 10:43 PM

See how it plays out, but I intend to take some of this, and intergrate it into the Metal thread, when it's run it's course (you'll be credited) , but it's a good way to see what kind of bands we talk about from the very first page.


That's cool, you can put it in the metal thread if you want. I don't really care about being credited or whatever. All I really did was make a list of bands, it's not like I Created A Wrestler (in that case I would want credit for that). :D

So...
Alright I guess I'll see how it plays out. Also, I'm not like upset at you or islash for questioning this. I already felt like I might have created a monster when I sat there and looked at my word document. But I figured it was sitting there on the page, I might as well post it here and follow through.

At first I thought, I could speed this up by having people just pick 2 bands instead of 3. But that screws up the math down the line. Sure they could only pick one band from each block of 6... and I think for a few groups it might be interesting. But the amount of wide open contests would be maybe 3 or 4 blocks of the 36! And in a few cases, a winner might as well be crowned before it begins. Nobody is going to be Priest in that heavy metal grouping for instance if only one band emerges from each in round one.

#22 »highlight

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 11:20 PM

Where is Down (supergroup)??? Kidding, you have a respectable amount of bands already. Hell, I think even Alter Bridge is considered progressive metal in some places.

Do you plan on wrapping this up by 2014? :P

Edited by »highlight, 25 April 2012 - 11:36 PM.


#23 AssaultDriver720

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 11:45 PM

I wouldn't call All That Remains Pop metal.

#24 unknownsold13r

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 03:39 AM

Well All That Remains was metalcore, but they glossed up their sound a bit with some of their newer releases. That's sort of splitting hairs though as it's a band that I honestly don't think would go real far no matter what block they were in.

C'mon Assault, you have a lot of knowledge when it comes to metal, I was kinda hoping you could help me out some with that one empty bracket I have up there.

And the stuff I need help with overall is tougher calls than where to put All that Remains.
Such as:
Is Biohazard truly crossover thrash? I wasn't sure. So I just randomly worked that into a conversation that was about music already with a fellow metalhead buddy. He seemed to think they were. I thought of them as more just kind of straight metal but with some hardcore style lyrics and themes.

Where is Down (supergroup)??? Kidding, you have a respectable amount of bands already. Hell, I think even Alter Bridge is considered progressive metal in some places.

Do you plan on wrapping this up by 2014? :P


Oh lol, I remember the Supergroup discussions we had. :lol:

And I hope that I can wrap this up before 2014... though I'm about to check up on my family lineage, just to make sure it was not my ancestors who built the Titanic, otherwise we might have a pattern developing here. I think I may have outdone myself.

Plus, it just has to finish before 2014, because there isn't going to be a 2014 or a 2013. Dick Clark died, which means the Mayans were right, because no one else can count us down to the new year. :shifty:

#25 Fried

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 04:11 AM

Just some more general thoughts about the BM bracket and more

First wave; I agree with Bathory (formed 1983), Hellhammer (formed 1982). Venom I don't really class as BM, maybe NWOBM or Speed Metal, it just so happens they've got a record that named a genre. I think Celtic Frost could be moved to a different bracket. By 1987 they were already writing more avant-garde/progressive material. I love Mercyful Fate but I can't really classify them as BM. I think they're HM but with a more evil twist than a lot of their contemporaries.

Some bands not mentioned that maybe could fit:
Sarcófago from Brazil (formed 1985 featuring the original singer of Sepultura - "If you are a false don't entry!").
Root from the Czech Republic (formed 1987. They sort of bridge the gap between first and second wave)
Tormentor from Hungary (formed 1986)
Samael (from 1987)

Second wave looks about right to me. I'd probably fit Emperor there instead of Gorgoroth who were kind of substandard to me. I'd probably try to fit Ildjarn in there maybe instead of Enslaved, Enslaved would fit for me more Progressive/Viking, especially after Frost, but I think that's more, and as is with most of this post, just personal opinion I guess.

edit: Thinking about it further it does seem heavy on the Norwegian stuff when in reality there was a lot of stuff, different to the Norwegian stuff but still BM, that was around then that was just as interesting like: Beherit, Master's Hammer.

Third wave:
I think Dimmu Borgir should be in the Symphonic bracket with Cradle of Filth etc. I was into the first few Sigh records but I think they're so far gone now into the Avant-garde realm.

Funeral Doom:
I'd love to see Thergothon there. And maybe Skepticism.

Proto-Metal:
Sir Lord Baltimore
"back in 1971, Mike Saunders reviewing the 1970 SLB release Kingdom Come for Cream Magazine said, "Sir Lord Baltimore seems to have down pat most all the best heavy metal ticks in the book."
.

Edited by Fried, 26 April 2012 - 04:30 AM.


#26 unknownsold13r

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 05:06 AM

Thanks very much man! I'm going to make some changes. BM is the one large genre that I don't really listen to or have much knowledge about. Neither my friends or I knew much at all about it, back in the day when we first got into thrash and death and whatever else back in high school. And since then, I just didn't really get into it. But I still don't want to put up misinformation in this post, because people are looking to this post, and I don't want to get shit wrong or mislead people, especially in a large genre. And certainly not since right now this gauntlet is more of a Sam Dunn-esque metal tree than a tournament since it hasn't started yet.

I'm going to add some of those names. Does Sacrofago just include the early Sepultura singer or did like the Cavalera's play in that band too? I'm trying to keep most entries separate, since Sepultura is already in. But it is based off of their later stuff given that I put them in the Groovy thrash block, hehe.

What would you suggest for third wave? Is there an official third wave? If not, then who are all these BM bands that people write reviews for that I've never even heard of?

Sir Lord Baltimore... now that is a name I am 100% unfamiliar with and they are American too. Piqued my interest, so I had to look them up. From what I'm seeing they are actually from NY not Baltimore, lol. Either way they probably should be in the proto-metal group, even though they are somewhat obscure. I'm listening to what I could find of them on YT right now, they are pretty cool. They have a bit of a Deep Purple type of sound but more raw and free form.

As for Fun. Doom... Skepticism, they totally slipped my mind. I thought about adding Thergothon, but I'm pretty sure everyone else in my block was still touring and those guys split up a while back. Not that that matters really, but narrowing shit down to 6 names is tough and I use trivial reasons at times. Hierophant missed that list for the same reason. And Catacombs could have taken it's place, but I'm pretty sure dude still only has one full album under that name so far.
I half expected you to suggest Mournful Congregation. They are pretty solid, but not real known.

Thanks again for the input.

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 05:20 AM

Dick Clark died, which means the Mayans were right, because no one else can count us down to the new year. :shifty:

YOU'RE THE ONLY ONE WHO UNDERSTANDS :lol:

#28 AssaultDriver720

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 05:38 AM

Well All That Remains was metalcore, but they glossed up their sound a bit with some of their newer releases. That's sort of splitting hairs though as it's a band that I honestly don't think would go real far no matter what block they were in.

C'mon Assault, you have a lot of knowledge when it comes to metal, I was kinda hoping you could help me out some with that one empty bracket I have up there.

And the stuff I need help with overall is tougher calls than where to put All that Remains.
Such as:
Is Biohazard truly crossover thrash? I wasn't sure. So I just randomly worked that into a conversation that was about music already with a fellow metalhead buddy. He seemed to think they were. I thought of them as more just kind of straight metal but with some hardcore style lyrics and themes.


Where is Down (supergroup)??? Kidding, you have a respectable amount of bands already. Hell, I think even Alter Bridge is considered progressive metal in some places.

Do you plan on wrapping this up by 2014? :P


Oh lol, I remember the Supergroup discussions we had. :lol:

And I hope that I can wrap this up before 2014... though I'm about to check up on my family lineage, just to make sure it was not my ancestors who built the Titanic, otherwise we might have a pattern developing here. I think I may have outdone myself.

Plus, it just has to finish before 2014, because there isn't going to be a 2014 or a 2013. Dick Clark died, which means the Mayans were right, because no one else can count us down to the new year. :shifty:


Well dude when i read this topic it was after i just got home from seeing Rings of Saturn, Aborted, Decrepit Birth, Cattle Decapitation and Origin so i was tired so don't kill me. Biohazard isn't crossover Thrash there way different then bands like D.R.I. and Suicidal Tendencies.

Edited by AssaultDriver720, 14 May 2012 - 02:54 AM.


#29 unknownsold13r

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 05:45 AM

My bad, how was that show?

That's what I initially thought with Bio.

#30 AssaultDriver720

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 06:14 AM

My bad, how was that show?

That's what I initially thought with Bio.


Pretty good show for a Tuesday night pick up a couple of Origin Cds. Don't get why Bio gets class as Crossover Thrash.

#31 unknownsold13r

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 06:33 AM

I switched them out and replaced them with Crumbsuckers. Not sure if they are too hardcore punk though.
I changed a bunch of stuff.

I think it's the lyrics that made me consider Biohazard there. I hadn't heard Biohazard in quite a long while, but I just recently heard a single by them called Vengeance is Mine or something like that. It certainly wasn't crossover thrash, but then again neither is modern Corrosion of Conformity either, but yet they were one of the top crossover bands.
The lyrics of Biohazard always seemed kind of punk inspired. I had my doubts though, even ran it by someone too, just out of the blue and they said "yeah".
But I'll take your word over his on it though.

That's cool bout the show. I vaguely remember... I think it was you posting up some concert footage of an Origin show here before. How were the openers? The only one I'm familiar with is cattle decapitation.

#32 AssaultDriver720

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 06:41 AM

I switched them out and replaced them with Crumbsuckers. Not sure if they are too hardcore punk though.
I changed a bunch of stuff.

I think it's the lyrics that made me consider Biohazard there. I hadn't heard Biohazard in quite a long while, but I just recently heard a single by them called Vengeance is Mine or something like that. It certainly wasn't crossover thrash, but then again neither is modern Corrosion of Conformity either, but yet they were one of the top crossover bands.
The lyrics of Biohazard always seemed kind of punk inspired. I had my doubts though, even ran it by someone too, just out of the blue and they said "yeah".
But I'll take your word over his on it though.

That's cool bout the show. I vaguely remember... I think it was you posting up some concert footage of an Origin show here before. How were the openers? The only one I'm familiar with is cattle decapitation.


Could have put Cryptic Slaughter or Cro-Mags.

#33 unknownsold13r

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 06:46 AM


I switched them out and replaced them with Crumbsuckers. Not sure if they are too hardcore punk though.
I changed a bunch of stuff.

I think it's the lyrics that made me consider Biohazard there. I hadn't heard Biohazard in quite a long while, but I just recently heard a single by them called Vengeance is Mine or something like that. It certainly wasn't crossover thrash, but then again neither is modern Corrosion of Conformity either, but yet they were one of the top crossover bands.
The lyrics of Biohazard always seemed kind of punk inspired. I had my doubts though, even ran it by someone too, just out of the blue and they said "yeah".
But I'll take your word over his on it though.

That's cool bout the show. I vaguely remember... I think it was you posting up some concert footage of an Origin show here before. How were the openers? The only one I'm familiar with is cattle decapitation.


Could have put Cryptic Slaughter or Cro-Mags.


Cro-Mags. Did not even think of them. Not real familiar with Cryptic Slaughter though. Are they better than Cro-Mags in your opinion?

#34 AssaultDriver720

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 06:58 AM



I switched them out and replaced them with Crumbsuckers. Not sure if they are too hardcore punk though.
I changed a bunch of stuff.

I think it's the lyrics that made me consider Biohazard there. I hadn't heard Biohazard in quite a long while, but I just recently heard a single by them called Vengeance is Mine or something like that. It certainly wasn't crossover thrash, but then again neither is modern Corrosion of Conformity either, but yet they were one of the top crossover bands.
The lyrics of Biohazard always seemed kind of punk inspired. I had my doubts though, even ran it by someone too, just out of the blue and they said "yeah".
But I'll take your word over his on it though.

That's cool bout the show. I vaguely remember... I think it was you posting up some concert footage of an Origin show here before. How were the openers? The only one I'm familiar with is cattle decapitation.


Could have put Cryptic Slaughter or Cro-Mags.


Cro-Mags. Did not even think of them. Not real familiar with Cryptic Slaughter though. Are they better than Cro-Mags in your opinion?


Hmm i don't know i like both bands but it depends on you if you think there better then Cro-Mags.

#35 unknownsold13r

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 07:38 AM

Going with Cro-Mags for right now based on name recognition. Might change it later.

What I like about the crossover block is that I think almost any 3 bands in it could win it. Some of the other thrash blocks are rather top heavy, but not too much that can be done about that. I mean when 3 of the Big 4 fit neatly into one thrash block, those will likely be the 3 that win easy.

#36 AssaultDriver720

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 08:33 AM

Going with Cro-Mags for right now based on name recognition. Might change it later.

What I like about the crossover block is that I think almost any 3 bands in it could win it. Some of the other thrash blocks are rather top heavy, but not too much that can be done about that. I mean when 3 of the Big 4 fit neatly into one thrash block, those will likely be the 3 that win easy.


Alright go with the Cro-Mags on the Crossover list.

#37 Mustacio

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 05:44 PM

I can't find Black Sabbath anywhere.

#38 Crazy Moon

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 06:58 PM

^ First one in Classic under Doom.

I think Lacuna Coil, Static X, and The Gazzette should be on here.

#39 Mustacio

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 07:01 PM

Sabbath in doom?!

#40 HellHammer

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 07:58 PM

Put Watain in 3rd wave Black metal, and replace that slot with Burzum for 2nd wave. Also add to the ?????? slot in First Wave Black Metal with Venom. I know Venom is actually pretty much thrash/nwobhm but it had tremendous impact on Black metal more than any other whether you want to get technical about it or not. Also they were much dirtier, controversial, and evil than other nwobhm/speed metal bands in the early 80s.





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